Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

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Started by kevnbety at 03-14-2005 11:04 PM. Topic has 80 replies.

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03-14-2005, 11:04 PM

kevnbety

Joined on 02-02-2005
East Tennesse - NS & CSX Country
Posts 309

Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

	I have heard that metal wheels have less "rolling resistance", therefore making it easier for your locomotives to pull a train than the plastic wheels that come on most rail cars. Is this true? If so, how much does it REALLY help? Thanks for replys, Kevin
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03-14-2005, 11:09 PM

Butch Cassidy

Joined on 03-06-2005
Posts 47

RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

	Kevin when it comes to running a good layout you will also need good cars. The wheels are very important and anyone here will tell you that you should have metal wheels and they make quite a big difference. All the newer cars come with metal wheels because they are better. They do roll much better and I reccommend that you always put on metal wheels to the cars that do not have them. I converted all my cars that I bought without metal wheels to the metal ones. I get Life like metal wheels for $4 a pack. You gotta have your layout hooked up dawg. So do you your thing
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03-14-2005, 11:16 PM

ac4400fan

Joined on 03-12-2005
Arizona. Born And Raised In Chicago ILL.
Posts 732

RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

	never herd of that ,,but what i know is that the plasic wheels conduct alot of rail build up,therefor! i would recomendmhaving the metal wheels,and have alot of less ,clean up every month, ps,plasic wheels get rid of em ,,just to help , :))))) GO> Chicago NorthWestern.BNSF& Illinios Central, AC4400 ALLTHE WAY! DREAM IT! PLAN IT! BUILD IT!
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03-15-2005, 12:09 AM

twhite

Joined on 07-07-2004
Carmichael, CA
Posts 4,542

RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

	I'm in the process of replacing all of my cars with metal wheels, and the difference in pulling power of some of my locomotives is VERY noticeable, especially some of my brass locos that were never 'great' pullers. I have a couple of Custom Brass Rio Grande mountains that are very handsome, but not the best pullers I've ever had, but with metal wheels on the rolling stock, it seems to have improved their performance by about 50%. I used to have to double-head them to get twenty cars over the 2-2.4% grades on my line, now each one of them can handle twenty metal-wheeled cars with ease. And it's certainly improved the time I used to spend cleaning the rails. Besides, those shiny treads look really COOL! Tom [^][^] Tom View my layout photos! http://s299.photobucket.com/albums/mm310/TWhite-014/Rio%20Grande%20Yuba%20River%20Sub One can NEVER have too many Articulateds!
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03-15-2005, 5:36 AM

locomotive3

Joined on 01-30-2001
US
Posts 2,632

RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

	BE careful! Not all HO metal wheel axles are the same length. That's due to different truck manufacturers that the model car manufacturer uses.
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03-15-2005, 5:41 AM

fire216

Joined on 09-21-2002
liverpool
Posts 25

RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

	i have converted most of my fleet over to metal wheels since the club i belong to allows only metal to run on the club layouts....i have seen a dramatic improvement of performance AND appearance.....they weather nice...and sound great.....i switched over to proto 2000 wheels.....a little pricey for about eight bucks for only three cars worth....but i did not have to "gauge" any when installing.....now....what to do with all the plastic ones....hmm....maybe a new industry that makes axles?"?
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03-15-2005, 6:57 AM

tomwatkins

Joined on 12-08-2002
US
Posts 692

RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

	Metal wheels make a very big difference. They do have less rolling resistance than plastic, and they don't deposit "gunk" on the rails, reducing the need to clean the railheads. If the wheelsets or your locomotive wheels have blackening on the treads, removing it and polishing the treads also helps reduce the need for cleaning the rails. Have Fun, Tom Watkins
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03-15-2005, 7:19 AM

AntonioFP45

Joined on 12-02-2003
Good ol' USA
Posts 7,595

RE: RE: RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

QUOTE: Originally posted by BoRockhard

QUOTE: Originally posted by alturasandlonepine

Does someone make metal wheels for N? I've been modeling for some time now and have never seen them on the market.

HO people: Beware of LifeLikes metal wheels. They are grime magnets! Go with Intermountain or Kaydee.

BoRockhard,

I've switched most of my freight car fleet over to P2K wheels. I have a test track shelf and not a layout yet but what you say is interesting.

Have you used P2K metal wheels and had a grime problem?

I am going to be buying IM wheels in the future to try them out.

Appreciate your thoughts.

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03-15-2005, 7:24 AM

SpaceMouse

Joined on 12-27-2004
Indiana, PA
Posts 9,662

RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

	Is it the wheels or axels that make the main difference in rolling? Is the main reason for the metals wheels keeping the track and wheels clean or there a significant improvement in friction (or is it the click-click click?) Chip Rock Ridge and Train City Indiana Branch PRR 1950 Space Mouse's Beginner's Guide to Layout Design
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03-15-2005, 7:36 AM

gsetter

Joined on 05-07-2002
Dearborn, Michigan, USA
Posts 1,553

RE: RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

QUOTE: Originally posted by locomotive3

BE careful!
Not all HO metal wheel axles are the same length. That's due to different truck manufacturers
that the model car manufacturer uses.

[#ditto]

There are differences in axle speifications between manufacturers. One brand will work with other brands of trucks but may be looser or tighter in another brand. Sometimes you are better off replacing the truck / wheel assembly. For example, the Proto 2000 truck / wheel assembly is extreamly free rolling right out of the box.

For free rolling wheels on any kind of truck, check and clean out the journal box where the axle seats. There may be casting flash. You can use a new #11 Exato blade to clean off the flash, however Micro Mark sells a special tool called a "Truck Tuner". And, if you don't already have one, buy a NMRA Standards Gauge to check the wheel gauge (They cost $3.50 if you are a N.M.R.A. member and buy it from them). N.M.R.A. Standards gauge is available in O, HO, & N scales. Sometimes the wheels are not in gauge out of the box.
Another tip for free rolling trucks is to use a powdered graphite lubricant on the journal box / axle point. Kaydee sells "Greas-em"

"Keep Your Wheels on the Rails!"
Gary

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03-15-2005, 7:39 AM

BRAKIE

Joined on 10-23-2001
OH
Posts 5,691

RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

	Metal wheels helps put the weight where it belongs on the rail head and keeps your freight car wheels and track cleaner.. The club I belong to uses P2K metal wheels.We find that these are good solid wheels that can be had at great discounts and very free rolling without any side affects. We do not find them to be dirt magnets under our rather hash operating conditions-perhaps that's because our cars sees a lot of real miles in a month's time far more then your adverage home or club layout usually sees...We need free rolling trucks due to our operating hump yard... However,most members are now beginning to favor the Athearn metal wheels that come on the RTR cars-not the Genesis line.These are very free rolling and seems to be better then the P2K wheel sets.[:D][tup] I use the Athearn truck with the P2K wheel set but,now finding I am favoring the Athearn's trucks over my combination. On my home layout 80% of my cars have metal wheels..The 20% that still has plastic wheels are Athearn trucks.These are also very free rolling..One of these years I might get around to changing these wheels out to metal wheels but,I am in no great rush as I still like plastic wheels.[8D][:D] Larry. Columbus & Hocking Valley Ry. Serving the Industries of the Hocking Valley.
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03-15-2005, 7:40 AM

DeSchane

Joined on 03-01-2005
Posts 51

RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

	BoRockhard, I can't agree with your assement of LLP2K metal wheel sets! Upon what are you basing your opinion? In this case, metal is metal! Of all the metal wheels out there LLP2K's are the most realistic, with their silver treads, lettering and a choice of chilled or flat backed. Money wise they are the best bang for the buck. I have more than 75 cars with these wheels on them and my track and treads are clean! In rebuttle to your point, all I have ever heard on this topic is that Kadee's wheels are crap magnets! I have said this, as this an un-substantaited rumor I heard from one person! Kevinbety, Metal wheels are better, my opinion is that all the manufacturers metal wheels are good. There are some differances in the length of the avels in comparison to the truck frames that can be an issue. ReBOXX manufacturer's wheel sets with differant axel lengths if this is needed. Maybe they roll better, if the do, this is a plus. From a stand point of keeping the track clean alone, they are the way to go.
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03-15-2005, 7:42 AM

RoyalOaker

Joined on 02-03-2005
Posts 174

RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

	I have been switching my cars over to metal wheels. It's funny, With plastic wheels, when I left a car on a spur it would stay there. Now, with the metal wheels, the cars just role down hill, and I didn't even know that I had a hill for them to role down. [:I] I had to re-level my table to prevent this.[:)] I love the click, click sound also. I am not sure about the cleaning part yet, because I have only been using them for a few weeks. Dave
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03-15-2005, 7:47 AM

SpaceMouse

Joined on 12-27-2004
Indiana, PA
Posts 9,662

RE: RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

QUOTE: Originally posted by RoyalOaker

I have been switching my cars over to metal wheels.

It's funny, With plastic wheels, when I left a car on a spur it would stay there. Now, with the metal wheels, the cars just role down hill, and I didn't even know that I had a hill for them to role down. [:I]

I had to re-level my table to prevent this.[:)]

I love the click, click sound also.

I am not sure about the cleaning part yet, because I have only been using them for a few weeks.

I noticed the big difference being with the axels. When I changed to metal axels the cars started rolling. I did not notice any difference between platic wheels with metal axels and metal wheels with metal axels. My MDC old time kits came with metal axels and plastic wheels.

Chip
Rock Ridge and Train City
Indiana Branch PRR 1950
Space Mouse's Beginner's Guide to Layout Design

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03-15-2005, 8:59 AM

kevnbety

Joined on 02-02-2005
East Tennesse - NS & CSX Country
Posts 309

RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

	OK, you have all talked me into converting to metal wheels. My rolling stock is mostly Athearn "blue box" kits. Will the PK2 wheels fit those stock Athearn trucks, or will the trucks need to be replaced also? Thanks again, Kevin
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03-15-2005, 9:09 AM

RoyalOaker

Joined on 02-03-2005
Posts 174

RE: RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

QUOTE: Originally posted by kevnbety

OK, you have all talked me into converting to metal wheels. My rolling stock is mostly Athearn "blue box" kits. Will the PK2 wheels fit those stock Athearn trucks, or will the trucks need to be replaced also? Thanks again, Kevin

I am using P2K 33" for my Athearn BB and everything is running fine.

Dave

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03-15-2005, 9:14 AM

DeSchane

Joined on 03-01-2005
Posts 51

RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

	I have found the LLP2K wheels to plop into the Athearn trucks fairly well. Go for it! Spacemouse, When I ran cars with plastic wheels, after a few months, the wheels actually built up a layer of garp. Eventually the garp got so thick the wheels would derail from lack of flanges. I just looked at 10-15 cras with LLP2K wheels on them and saw no garp on them what so ever. This is after several years of running with no maintenance of the wheel treads. I have clearly convinced mysel that LLP2K is as good as any metal wheel set on the market!
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03-15-2005, 9:19 AM

BentnoseWillie

Joined on 01-04-2002
Nova Scotia
Posts 747

RE: Metal wheel sets. How much do they help?

	I generally use P2k wheels and am quite satisfied with them, though I do use Kadee periodically (usually when I go to get wheels and the shop is out of P2k). I also have been experimenting with Intermountain's code 88 "semi-scale" wheels, which are closer to correct scale tread width but compatible with standard HO track. In cases where the above brands don't work because of an axle that's too short or too long, I use Reboxx wheels. They only come in 33" diameter, but are available in various axle lengths to fit different trucks. B-Dubya -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Inside every GE is an Alco trying to get out...apparently, through the exhaust stack!
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